We had a real fantasy vision of our “farm” life when we found this property. “A Mini Farm!” we screamed and then we happily put on our blinders regarding all the day-to-day realities. I suppose that’s the job of the fantasy – it calls you to move swiftly with fierce excitement, knowing that you’ll cross/jump off the next bridge when you get to it. We watched The Biggest Little Farm no less than eight times as a family both before and during lockdown. We romanticized having a “mini-farm” like only two stifled city slickers could. In my “farm fantasy,” miniature goats would greet guests as they got out of their car – startling them at first, befriending them by the end of the weekend. In my fantasy, we’d be chasing rascal-y chickens back into the coop, with the naughty one always being a punk. We’d tuck in our “rag-tag group of misfits” – an alpaca, a mini-donkey, and a goat all snuggled together at night, and the kids would feed them every morning before they walk to school, and spend the weekend cleaning the stalls. And due to our excellent farm lifestyle and routines, our kids, who are far more privileged than Brian nor I ever were, would remain grounded, un-entitled, and become generous citizens in the world. Years of tending to our livestock, harvesting crops, and most importantly picking up loads and loads of shit on the daily would solve my biggest parenting fear. It writes itself! We need animals to snuggle with and shit to pick up!!
Wait, So Why Do You Really Want “Farm Pets”?
We have no plans of making this a business with their fur, milk, cheese, eggs or to breed them and sell off the babies. The real and only reason we want farm pets is that we really enjoy and love animals so much and we want more of them to take care of and snuggle with. We love our pups, including the multiple walks they require most days, so much. We were obsessed with our cats when we had them. We know that the right animals will bring us a lot of joy and hopefully vice versa. We aren’t doing it for optics or because we think it’s quirky and cool. We simply think it will be a lot of fun and we have a lot of love to give to animals. This is why making sure they are good “pets” is important to us (and very different than what is a typical good “livestock”). I’m admittedly not one of those people who want to take care of any animal off the street. While I wish I were, I’m not Kristen Bell, willing to take on any animal’s problems. I think it’s important to know who we really are going into this process. We want pets to love and take care of but know our bandwidth.
The Reality…
It’s wet and rainy for seven months of the year. Poop smells gross and can create parasites that make the animals sick if you don’t clean it up quickly. Parasites mean shots and vaccines that we have to implement. Fur needs to get sheared, toenails need to get clipped. We aren’t actual idiots and we know that owning animals is very different than petting them at a farm. So, is this the best idea? And if so which ones?
Before You Can Weigh In, You Need Some Facts:
- We both work/write from home and our schedules are pretty manageable most weeks. We’ve retained much of the slowness from lockdown, we are serious homebodies, and most of the kid’s activities are in the neighborhood. So the idea of tending to the animals and garden still sounds like what I want to be doing. In short – we have the time/desire.
- Brian wants to take the lead on all things animals, and he’s really driving this circus train. If he weren’t I would give it at least another year here to make sure we can handle it so I don’t overcommit myself. But his level of enthusiasm is off the charts, and in general, if Brian wants to do something, he does it really, really well.
- We have a feed barn and enclosed paddock which is about 1/4 of an acre. We are all set!! Right???
The Paddock & The Barn
So as you can see we actually are kinda set up – there is a fully enclosed paddock that has tons of grass/growth and shade. It’s not huge, but it’s big! And it’s not like we need it for any other purpose. So it is just sitting there.
The barn has two sides – one side has stalls, and the other is our kid’s current clubhouse for the summer (but at any point if we need it for animals we’ll do that).
Brian And I Were Both Raised With Farm Animals
This whole “want to have farm animals” started in our youth. Brian’s parents have a ranch-style home with a barn and a pasture in a horse community. It’s where he grew up, they still live, and where we got married. It’s incredible. He never owned a horse, but there are horses all over the neighborhood and often people would keep their horses in their pasture. I grew up in the woods of Coastal Oregon with a goat for blackberry upkeep and a lamb/sheep. The lamb was won by my oldest sister during a 4-H lamb scramble (uh, are we still doing that?) and we got to “keep” it. Yay us (not). My older brother put me on the sheep, trying to make me ride it which it did not appreciate. So for the rest of the summer, it would knock me down every time I stepped outside. I very much do not care for sheep to this day. My family also has a ranch in Wyoming and they are bonafide cowboys (NOT farmers, huge difference). So growing up we would go visit frequently and there they have all the animals (but for a real purpose, not for fun like us).
WHAT DO WE CHOOSE??????
So today imma walk you through our deductive thought process. It’s riddled with naivete and privilege, but that’s to be expected when you buy a “farmette” or a “gentleman’s farm”. I also want to make sure it’s understood that we know that for many people this is a livelihood full of unbelievably hard work and I don’t want to diminish that by acting like it’s just a fun hobby that we can easily do. We know it’s work which is why we are taking our time and researching to figure out what makes sense for our family and this property. We know this won’t be easy or natural to us, but we are hoping it will help our family grow in ways (just like our pups did) and create lots of moments of joy for our kids and our neighborhood,
Chickens???? Everyone Has Chickens!!
The obvious first choice is chickens. The Pandemic Poultry Pet! Of course, we’d love fresh eggs and chickens are funny and unthreatening to kids (plus they put themselves to bed at sunset which seems mindblowing). But the more we research we have decided to take a pause on chickens for now for the following reasons:
- Rats – I guess our neighborhood in particular has a lot of chicken coops and a lot of rat problems. We lived in New York for 10 years. We dealt with rats in our apartment every day. So to make sure you don’t get rats you need to pour a cement pad (or so we’ve been told) and that’s a level of commitment that we aren’t close to yet.
- Chicken poop is a real thing – It smells, has to be cleaned up frequently, and can cause diseases. We fear that this might be too much for us. We are idealists, but we also know our weaknesses.
- The main reason we wanted chicken is for the daily eggs, but in Oregon, there are so many farms that we can buy locally from with the best eggs ever so maybe our dollar is better spent supporting real farmers who make this their livelihood.
- Coyotes – We have a few large guys that visit the property in search of bunnies, so we’d have to really enclose and protect those chickens which again means a financial infrastructure that we aren’t ready to commit to.
It’s not a forever “no,” but currently we aren’t going to get chickens (please convince us either way in the comments).
Goats! Miniature, Pygmie, And Miniature Pygmie
Try not to buy a baby goat after going to a baby goat birthday party at a baby goat farm. Side note: Baby goat parties are Oregon’s version of LA parties where actors come in different character costumes (Frozen, Star Wars, pirates, superheroes, you name it). It’s funny how different states have different birthday party industries. In short, baby goats are so cute but they grow up to be big goats and I’m not sure we love big goats as much as we need to. Nothing is off the table (ha, goat/dad pun), but Brian and I aren’t currently leaning into goats for whatever reason (ok fine, some of them creep me out with the whole square white eyes thing and often their butts have a lot of grossness in them). Again, while I realize how pretentious this all sounds I think being honest with what you love/want/need and can handle is really important before you commit to taking care of another being. We don’t take this responsibility lightly so we have to feel really, really good about it.
Miniature Cows? Not So Miniature!!
There is a lot of misinformation out there in the miniature cow world. Y’all. These cows are not small. All the ones on social are miniature cow CALVES, babies. We just visited a farm outside Bend where we saw a few of their “miniature” cows which come up to my ribs and are 1000lbs. Sure, they are shorter than normal-sized cows, but they are so wide and still kinda terrifying! The one on the left above is a TWO-DAY-OLD BABY CALF. We even called about some miniature highland cows because the PR and marketing around them are so convincing, but the farm we called boasted that some were $45k each. FORTY-FIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS. I don’t doubt that these are the best in the world and maybe the owner saw my IG handle and thought that we were up for that investment, but I couldn’t get off the phone fast enough (mostly because I didn’t want to waste his time). Also with the rain, the highland cows with long hair aren’t the best idea. Still open to the idea, but we haven’t found a farm that had mini cows that felt the right fit for us.
Horses? Who Doesn’t Love Horses?
We all LOVE the idea of horses but we know they are a huge responsibility and we don’t think we are ready for that. I also got bucked off by a Shetland pony when I was nine so I still have a decent amount of fear around them. It’s actually been (hopefully) a great lesson to the kids because they know I’m a little scared but I keep getting back on them and they always celebrate me when I do 🙂 If someone needed a place to keep their aging horse we would totally be open to that, but for now, we aren’t pursuing adopting a horse.
PIGS! Do We Need KuneKune Pigs??
A few weeks ago we met this KuneKune pig and fell in LOVE. It was so funny, cute, and made us laugh a lot. All of us immediately responded to it so positively. This pig was in Bend and didn’t have any babies, so the following weekend we went to a breeder outside Portland. We loved the piglets, but we want to buy them from a breeder that has them socialized with humans from an early age. These piglets were very terrified of us because they were kept in a pen and while they might warm up to us, what we’ve read is that some are exposed to more animals/humans early on and therefore attach to them easier. We don’t want to have to chase around squealing piglets all day, but boy do we want some of these:
We were told that they also like being in at least pairs so if we were to adopt some KuneKunes we would adopt at least two. And then we’d stop eating Pork (yes, even bacon) forever. We’ve already talked to the kids about it and they have agreed.
Are Alpacas The Move??
Our love for Alpacas is unwavering. They are really funny animals that seem to have big personalities. We have been to 7-8 alpaca farms now and feel pretty darn confident that we want to adopt some. We have been recommended to adopt two lady alpacas, one pregnant so that we can help raise a baby and then have three. We like the short curly hair versus the long hair (mostly because of the rain) and since we aren’t interested in breeding, people say that ladies are better pets. Alpacas poop in a pile (all of them! in the same pile!) so it’s easy to clean up. The poop is also worth a lot of money to cannabis dealers which is interesting since we live in Oregon (they call it “Liquid Gold” for fertilizer). I’m sure there are one million things about alpacas that we don’t know and yet we feel ready for it and excited. The biggest challenge is that some of the farms we went to said that domesticated dogs are the biggest problem/enemy and that the dogs can attack them and vice versa. So thus the hog wire on the split rail fence to make sure that they stay separate. Our other big fear would be that our dogs would never stop barking at them every time they went outside.
So that’s where we are at – three alpacas and two pigs. I know it seems so random and maybe it is, but based on our in-person research these are the animals that all of us connect to the most and can’t WAIT to adopt. We would honestly LOVE any and all insight, good and bad. We know we are naive (it’s impossible to not be naive in this situation) so we want all the info to help. I’ll read every posted comment for the day I promise!!!!!! And thank you 🙂
The biggest question mark for me is : what are you going to do when you leave Portland (like this week) ? I’m sure you’ve thought of that, but I’d love to hear about it. It’s the biggest thing preventing me from adopting more animals: I have enough trouble finding a reliable dog sitter as it is.
I second the suggestion to have a reliable plan for when you travel — as in, look up options and talk to people now, before you get the animals, so you know what you’re in for. You don’t want to go into it thinking “oh I’m sure there’s someone,” only to find out that when the rubber meets the road, everyone is busy / booked up for 6 months / outrageously expensive / doesn’t like caring for whatever kind of animal you got / is too far away / etc. For example, I have extended family members who’ve recently gone all-in on a small farm (chickens, a bunch of barn cats, two cows), and one member of that family is literally missing the annual family vacation because someone has to be home to care for the animals. I’m sure there’s an option for getting around this! I’d just suggest knowing what your actual options are before you take the dive. Looking forward to “meeting” your animals on the blog when you get them!
Oh i know. its a real thing. Right now I have someone great. But yes, what if SHE goes out of town. Then we thought about how fun it would be to have a family stay here (say a new york family who wants a farm experience) so they could stay for free as long as they take care of the animals. But its defininitely a hold up. Even dog sitting gets really expensive.
Have you explored TrustedHousesitters.com? I used to own a pastured poultry farm with 200 chickens, and we had around 20 qualified applicants to housesit our farm for free. The ones we eventually picked honestly did a better job caring for our chickens than we did (in terms of cleaning out their coop so thoroughly) and were globally fantastic. It does usually require pre-planning but for a house like yours you will have zero problems getting eager folks to jump in to care for the animals!
Big endorsement for Trusted Housesitters!! It’s a dream come true! We get half a dozen applications immediately and have had nothing but great experience with house and pet sitting!
Came here to say the same thing. It’s a deal breaker for us because it’s been so hard to find good, reliable care.
My dad wanted a hobby farm and my parents have had to miss my daughters graduation this year, a vacation they had planned for years, because of the animals. No one is available for a full two weeks in high summer so they have to stay home. You need someone to check on the animals every day and so if you are out of town for a full day, you need your backup to come over and water the animals. This adds up, and pretty soon you are paying someone part time to be available to do this job. I think if you talk to any farm family, they will tell you that it’s a Commitment. I don’t see how it’s compatible with a second home and regular weekend jaunts?
My grandmother has horses on five acres, and we always know not to mark her down as a “definite” for any family gathering, since she might not be able to find someone to feed and care for the horses while she’s gone — even if it’s just for an afternoon.
The other thing is, she usually can’t make holiday gatherings, either. She has a full-time caretaker who lives on the property, but if she gives that person a holiday off, then that means she’s the one who has to do the chores for the day and she can’t join the holiday celebration.
She loves horses, she grew up around them and it was her dream to eventually have some on her own property, but she’s also very aware of the reality of the situation — I don’t think she’s ever taken an extended vacation that isn’t longer than a day’s drive away, just in case something goes wrong and she needs to come home.
I would stay away from goats. My brother has about 6 of them and they are scary. One hates females and chases you around, my sister in law has to make sure it is always locked up before heading outside. They also attack each other.
Listen, those animals are adorable (I’m a goat fan myself!). My main question is, what about when you all want to travel? Your kids are actually entering the sweet spot, for me, of family travel: old enough for you not to worry about diapers and meltdowns and naps but young enough to want to hang out with you! But if you want to go on a trip for spring break or spend a couple of weeks at the Mountain House or even send them to sleepaway camp while you and Brian travel, who will tend the animals? Are there people you can hire who will care for them for short spells?
Yes, there are people you hire for that, or friends who would look after your house and animals.
You should check out Lacy Phillips (if you haven’t already) – she runs a manifestation company called To Be Magnetic, and she’s also built up a farmette of sorts – donkeys, dogs, lots of cats, chickens, I think alpacas are next! Might be fun inspiration. I always like Gretchen Rubin’s quote, “Choose the bigger life” and I can see how adding animals will do that for you and your family! Have fun!
OH i know Lacy 🙂 I used her steps to get the farm (she spoke at that goop conference I went to years ago and figured it couldn’t hurt to try her manifestation steps). I didn’t realize that she went all in on those animals though. I’ll look it up. Also a big fan of Gretchen Rubin 🙂
i used her steps/program to get my 250-year-old house that i affectionately call my “nature witch cottage”! so fun to hear about.
You’re living my dream… Get the alpacas!!!
Okay I feel like I comment a lot but I get up early and read blogs over my morning coffee haha, so here I am. A few thoughts: Chickens: I don’t know about the rat situation where you are, but with a secure coop and food kept in rodent-proof containers (ie, metal bins with lids), I’ve never once had a rodent problem (whereas many mice that have gotten into my actual house – it’s old!). And chicken poop is not a huge carrier of disease – we clean our coop once a week and I’ve never had a problem with human OR avian disease (versus, say, goats, whose poop can transmit quite a few goat-parasites). So in my mind chickens are still a great option. Goats: get ready to up your fencing game by a lot. Also they do require a good deal of nutrient and parasite management. And if you don’t love adult goats then I don’t know if this is the option for you. Horses: you’d need to check the specs of your barn, horses require a higher clearance than other animals. Plus, yes, significant upkeep and $$$. Pigs and alpacas: these would be my picks for you!… Read more »
No to chickens. I live no too far from Emily and the rat issue is/was a thing a year or two ago when everyone was getting chickens. People then started actively getting rid of them and guess what? The rat problems went away. Don’t do it.
hahah. yes so many of our neighbors have warned us. I want the eggs, but not if they come with a side of rats.
The pigs are adorable! Pigs are very clever, which is a pro but also a con, as they will think of mischief you haven’t predicted, though that might be funny. However, their shit REALLY stinks. They should be very trainable though, like dogs, and you could probably train them to use a specific corner of the field. I haven’t met the breed you mention, so maybe someone else has more experience of this?
Alpacas – find a reputable breeder and look into any birth defects the line before you take this on. They can be very inbred. Training the dogs not to bark at them should be pretty simple, they will get used to them quickly. They have to be sheared though, don’t they, even if you don’t want to use the fleece for anything? Is there someone local who could do that for you annually?
I would personally LOVE a miniature goat, and it’d eat your weeds/grass, but it would also eat flowers/trees/laundry. They are escape artists. But they are very very cute.
Yes to the smell of pig poo — especially on wet or humid days. And with pigs, I would think the fence liner would have needed to have been buried first. Otherwise, if they’re digging and rooting along the fence it will be easy for them to push under and be gone.
We had a rooster that terrorized us as kids but I do still like chickens, especially Aracuanas. Both the hens and the eggs are smaller but the color of the eggs are beautiful and the hens are super sweet.
haha. roosters scare me, too! And I think we can still bury and attach the hog wire (but i literally have no idea so theres that). and re shearing, a few of the farms we’ve talked to will come out and shear for you and teach you (so basically a hilarious concierge alpaca service). but I do think that learning to do it will be fun for kids
My first thought was the pig poo smell too… There is going to be a smell with any livestock and manure pile, but given Emily’s concern about chicken poo, I’d be waaaay more concerned by the smell of pigs!
My vote for a family wanting to learn about hobby farming would 100% be to start with chickens. They are fun and much less work than the other animals on your list. Rats can be a problem, but with a clean set up (contained feed, clean coop) it hasn’t been a problem for my family. Our coop has a wooden floor with chicken wire/steel wool in any holes.
Whichever animals you choose, my advice is to find a farmer mentor to learn from. Especially with kids, it’s important to learn how to safely manage and handle animals for everyone’s wellbeing 🙂 I consider horses to be “advanced” and would caution against taking in even a retiree without a serious and dedicated knowledge base that you can teach the kids.
yes i want to find a mentor, too!!
Living with Pickles, Maddy is a doll. Maddy will rescue the pets for you. Or maybe Lee of Asher House. He’s in Oregon. 💋💋
It sounds like you are going into this very clear eyed and willing to do the work which is exciting! To your point on raising (human) kids- as a child my family had two pet goats (on a rural property with 20 acres and a barn), and I have fond (and some not so fond) memories of waking up before the sun came up and stumbling outside in the dark cold with my dad to feed the goats before school. Although the commitment and routine were useful, it more so made me feel helpful and important, which was a great confidence booster at a young age. I say go for it, and do it now while the kids are young and can learn and grow from the experience! (Also, be very prepared to talk to kids about death- farm animals can get sick and die quickly, and it can be tough for kids after they become emotionally attached. But it’s a good life lesson too.)
thank you for this encouragement 🙂 I really appreciate it. xx
We had a handful of each kind of animal when I was a kid – pigs, chickens and cows (raised for beef, not dairy). I got VERY attached to the animals, and traumatically became a vegetarian at a very young age.
There are a lot of surrendered pet pigs and alpacas that need homes, so I’m sure you could give a loving home to some abandoned former pets that are highly socialized. Petfinder has highly socialized alpacas and pigs, and Pig Placement Network has lots of highly socialized pigs needing homes. / https://tinyurl.com/ycydfy6p.
Adopt dont shop.
People start with chickens because they are small, and that is essential with this sort of thing. My mom had chickens and the poop was not really issue, she let them free range and they fertilized the garden and ate ticks. She shoveled the poop from the coop to use as excellent manure for the garden. Chickens have a lot of personality and the lifespan is not 20 years like pigs and alpacas. She stopped since since the were a lot work and the cost to heat the coop became steep… Personally, I would also look into a rescue pony the kids can ride- if you’re gonna do all the work and cost to have livestock why not have something that’s multifunctional, and can lead to a new hobby, skills etc?
Loved your comment. There are a lot of farm animals that need homes, please consider this option.
So many discarded farm animals we have a local pig rescue that will likely shut down because she can’t get the financial help she needs to keep the place running from her farm (WA). Please consider: https://www.pigspeace.org/main/index.html
this is a GREAT idea. I’ll look up fostering some now! Thanks for the reminder.
Also, renting! I rent 2 bee hives every year. I can participate in their care as much as I want and I get the honey. I keep 3-5 hens and do deep litter; we have no odor problems. I switch out the bedding a couple times a year.
there are also foster opportunities for horses and donkeys. They can have very unique personalities so a try before you buy relationship is helpful.
This is so interesting! I live in PA surrounded by working farms (crops, horses, cattle, etc.). Mine is a rural area where this is the norm. Since you’re in the city, could you share some insight into how the zoning works? Is it considered light industrial and residential? Are you beholden to the restrictions (if any exist) of the surrounding neighborhood?
The Biggest Little Farm was such an interesting documentary. Heartbreaking but also uplifting. There is so much outside expertise, help, and monitoring required to do anything on that scale! Such a cool dream but truly a full-time job.
So Portland is unusual compared to other large cities in that you can have livestock within city limits as long as your lot is large enough. There are rules about the sort of shelter provided to the animals and for some “social animals” such as pigs you are required to have at least two so they are not lonely.
Yes, but you’re limited in type and number of animals you can have commensurate with your lot size.
Oh! Have you connected with Mel from Mel’s Kitchen Cafe blog? She might have some good tips about animals, kids and mini-farms. Plus, yummy recipes to boot. : )
I thought this, too! She has those types of pigs and loved them! She has a separate farm account where she talks about them.
My sister has a new farm in NC and they bought a miniature donkey and miniature horse (because they’re wonderful pets) but also because they want to host kid birthday parties. Never have two farm animals been so loved. They’re gentle, extremely intelligent, and carefully guard the rest of the farm animals. Would highly recommend! https://www.foxfiremeadow.com
Oh those guys are so cute! I have to say, horse manure always smells great to me, while pig poo. not so much
I know that you are a reader so I am suggesting that you read the Hillwilla trilogy by Melanie Forde. It is a story about a woman who ends up living on a farm with a small herd of alpacas. Embedded in the story is all kinds of information about alpacas. I loved these books and I learned a lot about alpacas.
Bunnies can live in your barn and you can litter train them!
We live in the “city” with large lots and quite a few people have livestock. The coyote population is flourishing, but baby/small livestock not so much. Whatever you choose, I would choose something large in size and have more than one so they can fend for each other. And if you plan on babies, have a heard dog or something to keep the coyotes away. You may can get away with locking them up at night, just all depends on the density of your coyote population. Looking forward to seeing what you pick!
Fun fact – donkeys make excellent guards for other baby livestock. A farm near us in PDX keeps a donkey in the field with the cows when there are babies because she will fiercely defend against coyotes if needed (but mostly the coyotes just give her wide clearance!)
Near me donkeys are also used to
protect sheep against wolves, but they can be vicious. My former dog was attacked by a donkey when we were hiking in the Alps a few years ago, the vet said she saw lots of victims of donkey attacks!
The donkeys are not vicious except when there is the possibility of predation. Dogs can and do chase livestock, every bit as much as coyotes. They can “worry” livestock into panic and injury. One needs to keep dogs out of pastures unsupervised where there is livestock! We had a promising show Arabian weanling and the trainers dog, raised around livestock, sweet as can be, decided out of the blue to chase our gelding and he ended up dead.
One also must consider the cost of large animal veterinarians. The cost of small and large animal care is very expensive, even routine care. An emergency call even more. Having farm animals is akin to having toddlers. They need consistent, knowledgeable and loving care 24/7. There is never a holiday from the responsibility; repair and upkeep of their barn and fencing is constant.
By the way, Highland cows were originally bred in Scotland, which is wet, rainy and cold. Their coats are what protects them from these elements.
Donkeys can also be murderous. Ours attacked all dogs (they can’t decipher between a dog and a coyote) and killed multiple baby goats. I’d never ever have another donkey for protection. Alpacas, llamas or livestock guardian dogs are much better.
We have had fallow deer – beautiful to watch, easy to take care of. We are currently looking at miniature donkeys, which the Smithsonian National Zoo says make the “perfect companions for people of all ages.”
Yes! Our mini donkeys were SO FUN! And easy! And cute! Def recommend these guys!
How about waiting a year to see how you feel then? Your family has been through a roller-coaster of changes. That’s stressful, even when it’s the good kind of stress.. Seems wise to allow yourselves some more settling-in time before taking on a crew of large (or small) mammals, their vet bills, their poop and other details not yet known. None of that will be a walk in the park, esp. in your rainy climate.
As a fellow Portlander…that’s a brilliant suggestion, Ally.
Please live here full-time, year-round, season-wide in your new home. Relish. Assess. Consider realities. Experience joy.
Then…consider…um…shall we say…additions! Guaranteed they will be complicated.
Portlander here. What a lot of readers may not realize is that we have some extremes in our climate. Yes, it rains a lot in the winter, but it’s also very hot and extremely dry (if not 100% dry) for at least 3 months in the summer. Keeping animals safe and healthy when it is 90-100+ degrees is an immense responsibility.
Also, we go below freezing frequently in the winter, and animals need access to water at all times – you’ve got to get out there and bring them either warm water, and/or break up the ice and change their water multiple times a day.
It sounds like fun making this decision. I just wanted to throw in a few things about donkeys, which I know you weren’t considering but I did see one in your posts images. And probably because I just read and loved the book “Running With Sherman” by Christopher McDougall (https://www.amazon.com/Running-Sherman-Donkey-Heart-Hero/dp/15247323620). It is a true story about a rescue donkey running the Leadville Donkey race (man trying to run with donkeys that very much have a mind of their own). So good. Also, what appears to be a fact, donkeys will guard against coyotes, like kill them!! You can google it, which I did after a guy in Texas told me about how his donkey was keeping his miniature horses safe. This finally leads to the suggestion that you research how much of a threat the coyotes you’ve seen around your place would be to the alpacas…especially a baby one.
All the best,
Holly
SUCH a great book and it came to mind immediately for me too.
Hi Emily! We too have had a small farmette and know the joy that daydreaming about it can bring! Seeing my daughter trudge through the field to feed her horse before school was priceless and brought her a lot of joy and grounding (like all hard work done well does)…I’d throw in one more idea in the chicken realm…bantam chickens! (my fave) They are miniature chicken that kids LOVE. Many benefits…less poop, less stink, easier to catch, some like to be held (mille de fleurs), and can be left for days with the right food/water situation. Won’t feed you breakfast though. If you go that route, get all different breeds because the pecking order is a real thing and so fun to watch. Check out silkies (many colors), mille de fleurs, frizzles. My prized Mille de fleur, Cordelia, would jump into my lap on the deck. I’ve always ordered from Mypetchicken and all have arrived safely. Alpacas are territorial so I would think coyotes wouldn’t be a problem if you go that route. Can you tell I’m team chicken over here 🙂 Have fun!
Also recommend fly predators no matter what you choose. Natural fly control. Check out Spalding Labs. Still daydreaming about your farmette 🙂
Wow. THANK YOU for this recommendation, we have a chronic fly problem and even our outside pest control folks only say to “try sticky fly traps”. Just placed an order … feeling hopeful!
My sister lives in a rural area near Dallas. She has two small potbelly pigs. She would agree with advice to get pigs that have been socialized with humans. She loves her pigs and has trained them One problem, though, is that she is an avid gardener, and the pigs constantly root up her flowers and shrubs. (They know they are not “supposed to” and look around guiltily to see if she is watching before doing it, but it seems to be an irresistible pig urge. ) She has trained the pigs to walk up a ramp into her SUV which is helpful for vet visits. However, although she is in a rural area, it has been extremely difficult to find a vet who will take care of pigs, even small pet pigs. So, please double check the local vet situation for your pigs and alpacas.
I love this: “an irresistible pig urge.” I feel you, piggies!
i know that is SO CUTE. They are just so cute!!!!
the vet situation is valid in my area as well, most “feeder” pigs are kept for about 6 months then harvested so pig health care isn’t usually in high demand. good shearers are hard to find as well, i suggest finding a good, reliable one before purchasing the pets. another tip i would give would be to find a buyer/taker for your fibers, my sister has to drive from WA to ID to get a decent price as there is overwhelming supply of fiber in our area.
A few thoughts: please don’t entire discount a single large goat! They are amazing for weed control, and can have pretty zen personalities! I once visited a town in Nova Scotia on the coast (a rocky cove) where they had a town goat with a collar and name tag and bell. He was the head of their landscaping department, haha. As for pigs and alpacas: remember that all animals are like people in that they have personalities. They can be loving, sweet creatures, but they can also be jerks. A mean alpaca is a pain in the butt (literally). As long as you are prepared to have some animals that might not be the ideal best buddies, you really have selected two of the nicest species to care for. I’m along for your journey!
I’m not sure why someone downvoted your commnet. It makes a very good point. If one of the animals she picks turns out to not be a cuddler or even a bit cranky, will they want to give it to a rescue or someone else? My POV is that once you bring an animal under your care, it is for better or for worse, for the rest of the animal’s life.
yah, I suppose if they ended up being dangerous or hurtful to our kids that would be a real thing, but there is always a risk with any animal that they won’t be the ideal pet (thus our hesitation and research) and we would be very very resistant to rehoming.
I’ve never known an aggressive goat other than an intact male (that are also the stinkiest and grossest creatures ever). You may want a polled goat so as to not have to worry about the horns, but goats generally are pretty chill. Especially bigger ones.
You should never have a single goat. They are social creatures and do best with at least one other companion.
A quick note – goats are social animals so unless you have a horse or a donkey, you should never just have one goat. Though it would look adorable in a portrait of an English country cottage, tied up and eating daisies next to a little girl in a large-brimmed hat picking daisies for her mama
I follow many goat owners and they always say you need two or more. They are herd animals and need a companion.
Oooooh! 😃Yaaaay! Goats – If you’re considering goats, they are absolutely Houdinis! You’ll need better goat-proof fencing! One escape and they’ll remember how yummy all your flowers and ornamentals tasted and will find another way to get out! Chickens – do not get a rooster, just ladies and be prepared to love tge old girls when they stop laying and hsve them as pets. They can be quire the individual characters. (Does this mean ypu stop eating chicken??) Maybe don’t ever consider ducks, because co trary to folklore they don’t get on famously, at all. And if ypu ever gave a rooster it’ll go nuts with the female ducks too. Not great! Be prepared to clean the coop much more than you expect to. Alpacas – They’re adept at fending off predators, but Cyotes? Not so sure. Real cgaracters, so make sure you cgeck the personalities of the two you cjoose, and tgat they’re already bonded. Pigs – So, so intelligent! It’s no wonder pigs’ organs have been transplanted into humans. You can teach tgem things similarly to dogs. Pony? I- ‘d get a donkey instead. We gad one as kids and they’re fab! Again choose tge personality. Overall –… Read more »
I have mini nubian goats and they are very sweet and affectionate and an easy size to handle. You do need a good fence with goats. Donkeys are great livestock guardians and very easy to take care of and have wonderful personalities. My donkeys keep the coyotes and bobcats away from the goats and chickens. Chickens keep the bugs down. If you want to free range them you’ll need a rooster to protect them. If you have rats, they will be around if you have a food garden or outdoor animals but other wildlife eat them or you can get a barn cat. I don’t have pigs, but you will need an outside area where they can root, plan for that area to always be dirt and mud.
Definitely check the city codes. I’m concerned your wants may not be in alignment with them.
You don’t sound naive at all. Quite the contrary, you have obviously thought about this thoroughly and from a lot of angles. The only thing I bumped up against is why you need to stop eating pork? Were you going to stop eating chicken if you adopted chickens? Animals can be for food and for pets – the world is full of nuance. 😉 Anyway, animals are so fun and this is the time to have them, when your kids are young and your life is tied to home. Have at it! Your choices sound perfect for you (and you can train your dogs to not bark at the alpacas) but I will throw in a vote for the pygmie goat. If you brought one of those babies home and raised her, you would love her forever. And she might become besties with your sweet pups. I’m team goat. (but I totally agree with you about passing on the chickens, ew)
ah thank you 🙂 and I don’t know why it feels weird to us re the pork thing (and why its different with chickens). I have a feeling we’ll fall deeply in love with them and have a new respect for the species (also we aren’t like massive pork eaters besides the occasional BLT so I suppose its not a huge lifestyle change).
In my experience, it’s actually much easier to leave farm animals than it is to leave dogs. Dogs need attention; farm animals do not. They just need to be checked on once a day. I have geese and ducks that free range on our property (that includes a pond) and they are so much fun to have.
Horse owner here – 1/4 acre pasture would be very small for a horse. You would have to bring in a ton of hay because they would graze it down very quickly and then you need to find places to store that hay out of the rain so it doesn’t get moldy. Also, I know that it sounds like you have relatives with horses so you may totally be aware of this, but a retired horse may come up with some health problems that would be difficult for first time horse owners to handle – prey animals get very good at hiding when they are injured or sick and sometimes problems can be hard to catch. Additionally, while some horses would accept other farm animals as a substitute for herdmates, most would prefer to have another horse friend to hang out with and suddenly you have an entire herd!
I wondered if Emily has the same issue with land for alpacas. Around here (rural NC) the saying is 5 acres per horse. If alpacas pull up grass by their roots like horses do, they’ll need a lot of land to spread out too – besides the grazing issue, the ground get so muddy so quickly. I don’t know anything about alpacas except that THEY ARE SO CUTE but do check out how much land they need to be comfortable.
The answer is goats. If anything, you want goats. They’re easy, they’re gentle, they’ll eat all the brush you want to get rid of, and their poop is … negligible. Growing up we also had a farmette with chickens, goats, sheep, and pigs (both miniature and regular) and lots of neighbors with cows and horses. All those other animals require much more upkeep, grooming/cleaning, space, etc. And their poop is much much worse, and there’s a lot more of it. Get goats!
We had the same thoughts –when my husband retired we bought a little “farmette”. We had chickens ( no problem with rats but we kept the food in a locked metal can) and goats and also a horse that we kept at a riding stable). No problem with cleaning up except where we had the manure pile was not far enough from our well, and the well got contaminated. We had to set up a mini-purification system to get the water drinkable. That would be my advice –make sure you are FAR away from your well
I appreciate you took the time to think about this, visit farms, and spend time with different animals before just jumping in. While even more time might be ideal, sometimes the heart wants what it wants. The fact that you and Brian did have animals growing up helps. That being said, I do sense that you have mixed feels about this. If pouring a cement pad for chickens feels like too much of a commitment, keep in mind that these animals will need you for years, will cost a lot over time in feed, vet bills, people to watch them when you’re all on vacation, etc. That’s a much bigger commitment than pouring a concrete pad and building a chicken coup. Maybe your desire to do all this for chickens is less than your desire to do this for other animals, but just keep in mind that this commitment is huge, beyond just the initial setup. Note: I have spent some time with alpacas and they seem really fun!
I totally see your point. I think re the cement pad we are just so done with construction for the time being so thats it. its not the cost or commitment its just I need a break from construction and if we are unsure then I don’t want to pour the pad (because we just demo’d out the worlds biggest sports court and its a real thing).
It sounds like you have really thought hard about this and are going into it with eyes open. AND it will still be more work than you realize and there will be complications you didn’t expect. Having had sheep on a hobby farm in Portland, in my experience the most trying aspects of having livestock on your property are: coyotes, mud, MUD, poop, flies, rodents (drawn to any feed you store for any animal because pasture may not be enough during the winter months or they will completely eat it down and your pasture will become a mud pit without grass), extra management in freezing weather, extra management in extremely hot weather, and going out of town. Going out of town during extreme weather also increases the burden of having someone watch them. Closing them in at night is safest for avoiding predators, but adds to chores – always being home at dawn/dusk and poop concentrates in an enclosed area. Last but not least, rehoming animals to safe caretakers should you have to move or decide you can no longer manage the upkeep. is very stressful. Oh, and I’ve had horses for 30 years. Do not rescue or board someone’s… Read more »
Out of curiosity, why do you say not to rescue or board someone’s horse? You piqued my interest!
It doesn’t look like enough space for a horse and in a small area a horse pasture quickly becomes a mud pit. The grass never comes back and now you have a horse standing around in mud and you are purchasing/moving hay in large-ish quantity. Horses fill about 1/4 – 1/2 wheelbarrow of manure each day, plus urine soiled bedding if they’re sleeping inside. That means creating a “poop pile” somewhere on the property that will need to be managed (turned/composted or hauled off) and draw significant flies. Mostly, horses are just as sensitive/fragile as they are amazing and require more care (time and money) to be well-kept. And… in 30+ years of horses, on both sides of the equation, I’ve rarely seen a barn owner-boarder relationship that doesn’t become fraught. Probably because of the time and money investment on both sides, in combination with an amazing, beloved animal.
THIS IS SO HELPFUL. honestly just listing out the challenges is so important for us to consider. And we will absolutely watch Clarkson farm – hoping that its kid-friendly so that the kids get it, too. thank you!
We watched with our 9 yo and there is some cheeky language but overall it was so informative, funny and dare I say; inspiring?!? Worth the watch.
My advice would be to wait another year while you do more research, figure out who would care for them while you travel, etc. Pigs and alpacas live for a LONG time so no need to rush the decision.
one thought- have you considered leasing your barn and paddock to an urban farm? Might be the best of both worlds as you could have someone experienced with livestock and willing to put in all the work in order to expand how much livestock they can have in a more urban setting. It’s something I’ve seen done where I live – we’re allowed two goats and six chickens per parcel within city limits, so an urban farmer pays for the goats and chickens and their care and we (along with almost a dozen neighbors) “house” them in our yards. We don’t get paid in money but we do get goat cheese and eggs and other products produced by the nearly thirty goats over sixty chickens and my kids love having animals to visit in our yard. Could be a marvelous compromise before you commit to taking on the care yourselves.
I have not considered this but I AM NOW. Wow, what a good idea!!!! Thank you so much. I might put it out there on social and see what we come up with!!
Yes! We have 124 acres and lease our pastures for beef cattle. Love it, because we get to look at them/talk to them/see them but aren’t taking care of them!
THIS.
You could also just pay a farm hand for however many days a week so you have more control over what and how animals/crops are grown and vacation time and soggy days are covered. I am always surprised how easy it is to find experienced help in the fields and paddocks where I live in the PNW. Keep in mind that animals kept on leased land are usually harvested, not pets, so that part could be tough. If you guys decide on an animal that produces more shit than you can handle, check with your county ag department, chances are there is a local directory you sign on to offer up your overstock dung for gardeners looking for soil amendments. Just like vintage, somebody always wants someone else’s shit. I think your family will be great care givers for whatever animals you bring to your farm.
If you’re not willing to make enough of a commitment to pour a concrete pad for chickens, I really question getting another, larger animal. While there may not be concrete pads involved, they’re also quite significant commitments.
As others have said, have a plan for when you travel. House and dog sitters can be hard enough to find during peak travel times – farm sitters are a whole ‘nother thing.
If you decide to consider a horse, perhaps look at Sound Equine Options, which is a horse rescue that has some wonderful horses available for adoption as pets and companion animals.
My thought would be they don’t really want to make that sort of commitment for chickens… because it’s not really chickens they want 🙂
true 🙂 and also we just don’t feel like booking a cement truck …
I grew up in the PNW and my aunt and uncle moved there in retirement, had a lovely property, and decided to raise alpacas, on a micro scale. I believe they also involved someone who was able to use their wool for a cottage industry…which would be so cool. If there’s a way to both indulge in the experience of caring for such wonderful animals AND share their natural resources (yay pot fertilizer!) then go for it. And it seems obvious to me that if you can afford to have these animals, you can also budget in a caretaker if/when you’re out of town. Also — I always appreciate your self-awareness regarding your privilege and snaps to your use of language acknowledging that — but whew. Also feels like it could get a bit pedantic. And this is coming from a BIPOC mom of a queer young adult, a trans child, and a bi-racial child. See you and love you : )
Having grown up in Iowa farm country, where there are a LOT of pigs, I can verify that pig manure smells the worst of any of them! And I mean awful! And you can’t get away from it. Some of my relatives are farmers. My cousin’s husband has a calving operation and the man has been on exactly one vacation in 35 years. I know it’s not the same, but it really will tie you down and there’s no option to not take care of it all in spite of cold, rainy weather, when you really don’t even want to go outside, etc. I know you know that. Maybe you can find someone who can take over for you whenever you’re gone (and you might have to do the same for them when they’re gone?). Also, how will the smells affect your neighbors? Are there any rules against having certain animals? Are there neighbors who also have animals? This from a person who doesn’t even have a dog because I don’t want to leave it for long periods and don’t want to walk it at 6am in the cold rain of Seattle! So- you have to take my warnings with… Read more »
Our neighbors had a large pig lot, and when the wind turned a certain way, usually at dusk, we had to go inside. Didn’t matter if we were enjoying the patio or having a BBQ, it was so stinky you just couldn’t stay outside.
that’s how I remember it, too!
Ducks!!! I had a random pet duck and she was the best. Poop isn’t too smelly and they are pretty easy to care for. Mine responded to her name and followed me around. I miss her!!
Emily, I live near you, have three kids in a similar age-range as yours, and have a property about a third of the size of yours. We’ve been at our home for two years, and this year we’re getting two Pygmy or Nigerian Dwarf goats and ducks (instead of chickens). We need help with the back forty, and we have feelings about goats the way you describe loving alpacas. We’ve heard from multiple sources that ducks are easier to maintain than chickens, our family loves duck eggs, and frankly, the idea of watching ducks waddle around the yard makes my family gleeful. Anyway, just wanted to share that you’re not alone in the Portland farm-animal journey! And, if you want Alpacas because you guys just LOVE those creatures, get them! You don’t have to rationalize away the other creatures if the ultimate answer is that your family just really wants alpacas.
INTERESTING!!! I honestly didn’t consider ducks at all and I feel dumb, but I didn’t know that duck eggs were such a thing to eat. Bringing this up to brian this weekend.
ducks don’t peck and scratch like chickens because they have webbed feet so they can be less destructive to plants and beds if free-ranging. they can also fly away from predators but still need protection when they are small. also they need a water source like a small pond so you would need to dig for that. so great for slug control. haven’t heard of many rodent issues like chickens with ducks.
We visited a farm that had Indian Runner ducks. They eat slugs, have tiny wings so they don’t fly, and lay a lot of eggs. Plus they look like bowling pins.
We had ducks and I loved them! However the water mess was intense. Before you get them do a lot of research on the easiest ways to keep their water clean. We just didn’t have the right set up for it and switched to chickens, but I LOVED to watch them waddle around. Ours would take evening flights around the farm and then land back at night. It was awesome. Do your research now so you can maximize enjoyment when you get them 🙂
Seconding ducks! They are easily the most joyful animals I’ve had and they love rain!!
The only thing I have to add is, don’t get goats and pigs and put them in the same area. We had them growing up and those goats were so smart! They’d butt the pigs around over to the fence, jump on the pigs backs, and jump over the fence! Definitely did not enjoy chasing those goats around to get them back in 😉
We also had chickens (and roosters). They are work, but I grew up in southeast wa and the coop was far enough away from our house we never had a problem w rats. We kept their food in a metal chicken feeder, and the extra was stored on a shelf in our garage. Honestly there’s something about getting your own eggs from your own chickens that is just cool. We even got an incubator and hatched some chicks! That was soo cool to watch as a kid!
Emily, You should definitely follow Neada on Instagram at houseonwillowhill & her adventures in raising alpacas & other animals! I bet she’d love to tell you what’s worked for her! She lives in a beautiful home designed by Lauren Liess.
I share the concern of what your plan is for the animals when you and Brian are both traveling. Who will care for the animals when you spend Thanksgiving with his folks or take two weeks to visit the Mountain House or go on a wellness/writer’s retreat? Farm animals require daily care, and there’s no kennel for alpacas or pigs.
Also, I think you live in Portland proper. Hopefully, you have researched the legal limits on which kind of animals you can legally get in Portland. It would be heartbreaking for you and the kids of if you had to give up the pigs because they were the wrong kind or had to get rid of two llamas because only one is allowed. I just don’t want you to end up in a situation like Chris Loves Julia did with their home office in North Carolina and find out too late about the requirements in your area.
Pigs are cute, but if chicken poop is too much for you, PIGS ARE MILLION TIMES WORSE. Pig poop is so toxic that industrial pig farms are literally classified as superfund sites, it smells as bad as human poop, and is worse in damp climates like Portland. Plus the mud wallows they need are not very picturesque.
Also something to keep in mind: rats will eat hay and other animal feed- so keep that in rat proof containers.
We’re on 5 acres out in Boring. We love our goats and chickens that are fenced in together. There are definitely pros and cons to every animal. I’m just here to encourage you to start small but go for it! Having my 5 and 7 year old out with the animals brings me immense joy. There’s a learning curve to it all but it’s worth it with kids!
I’m a horse owner in the PDX area. I’ve had my horse at a couple higher-end barns around town and now board at a retirement farm out in West Linn. I cannot tell you how hard it is to find good, reliable farm help in this area! Every barn owner I’ve is constantly looking for staff. I would make sure you have a very solid plan for farm sitting before you make any animal decisions.
That being said, I live in Sellwood and one of our neighbors has a little urban goat farm in their side yard. We call it the Goat House and it’s so much fun to stop and pet their guys. I talked to the wife a while ago and she said she doesn’t actually own them, she keeps them on loan from a goat party group! I thought that was a brilliant idea. So if you ever want to talk to someone about it, I bet you could leave them a little note about how they make it work! https://www.thebeenews.com/lifestyle/features/history-goat-house-finds-new-life-as-multigenerational-home/article_98f2e483-ff34-5782-85e1-c6df26ef6e6a.html
OMG! I know this house! We’re in SE, too, and it’s such a joy to see those goats!
I’d see if I could get someone else to board their animals for free on my mini-farm. Then you get to pet and see the animals, but don’t have to take care of or pay for them.
I don’t mean to sound like a bummer, but for the sake of preventing future heartbreak, is livestock other than chickens allowed in Portland? Personally, I would look into what’s legally permitted in your area and plan from there (I would *love* to have a little farmette someday, but I know my city has pretty tight restrictions on what’s allowed). Other significant factors to consider: who will care for them when you’re out of town, veterinary care, shearing, logistics of waste management once fully grown (with two pigs you might be looking at ~20 lbs of pig manure per day!).
I had the same question. I live near Emily and my understanding of residential zoning only allows for one llama (I’d assume this would apply to Alpacas) and only specific breeds of pigs.
Do you have 1/4 acre total, or do you have another pasture too? If you just have 1/4 acre I do not think alpacas are a good choice. They need room to run, play, and graze. Also, in no time at all alpacas will eat all of that grass down and in the winter you will have one big muddy mess. I do not know how tall your fencing is, but it doesn’t look very tall to me. Most people with livestock have fences 5′ tall, not so much to keep the animals in, but to keep predators out. Just a few more things to think on.
I’m excited! My parents are in NorCal and have goats and chickens, and I completely endorse you having pigs and alpacas! Haha. They look SO cute and SO fun and just the right amount of work. Are coyotes a threat to them? My parents have 150lb guardian dogs for this reason – to fight off/scare off mountain lions and coyotes. They used to have guardian llamas (who were beautiful but quite stand off-ish) – apparently llamas can square off with mountain lions with their mean side kick! Maybe the alpacas and pigs are big enough they’re not of interest to coyotes.
There will always be a lot of noise regarding animal rearing and owning – animals really bring out the protective instincts of internet communities. I appreciate getting to live vicariously through you, through the noise!
Please take it with a grain of salt, since everyone is different- but to me this seems like a huge stressor. If you are looking at this as a learning opportunity for your kids then there are plenty of ways to achieve similar outcome without making a very costly and time consuming commitment: volunteering at neighbouring farms, asking kids to take care of landscaping / vegetable garden, house chores, community work… Your kids are also growing fast and soon will want to spend less time with you and more time with their friends .
I wonder whether alpacas would require regular shearing, even if you’re not in it for the fiber. I don’t know anything definitively but I do know that sheep, e.g., actually *need* shearing on a regular basis, you can’t just leave them be. I have no clue whether this is the case for alpacas but something to look into. I’m a knitter and I absolutely LOVE working with alpaca yarn so this is where my brain went first!
They definitely need shearing. My neighbor did not shear hers last summer during the very hot weather and they both died from the heat.
3 words: Flemish Giant Rabbits! Size? Our oldest gals are in the 20+ pound range! Poop? Poop is NOT hot so encounters are less fraught -aaaaaaaand it is also highly regarded as fertilizer (plants in my yard have never been so happy : ). Personality? “They have as much personality as you’ve got time!” -me, wishing I had more time ; ) Housing? Our rabbits are in 8′ x 10′ pens outside with hutches within each enclosure. We have a rat-proof hutch for Mamas to give birth and safely raise their kits but we usually bring new litters into the garage for their safety and our ease of access (hanging out with a litter of Flemish Giant kits might just be Heaven on Earth -my brain is flooding my body with residual endorphins (that’s a thing, right?) right now <3 Predators? Our neighborhood Raccoons were, as far as we could tell, curious but aloof. As far as coyotes you would definitely want to tuck everyone into the barn at night (and have a safe space for the rabbits to hide if necessary during the day). Drawbacks? The one and only drawback of Flemish Giant Rabbits is that they are not… Read more »
PS. Almost forgot -Flemish Giant Rabbits are potty-trainable!